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Sports » rec.sport.basketball.college » Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search
| Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979170] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 01:31 |
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But is NC State willing to pay for a driver to ferry him on all his
recruiting visits?
- geoff
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979184 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 04:17 |
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Geoffrey F. Green wrote:
> But is NC State willing to pay for a driver to ferry him on all his
> recruiting visits?
>
Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach? What's wrong
with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
Finally, why did the powers-that-be fire Herb anyway without having a
Plan A, Plan B and Plan C?
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979190 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 04:10 |
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Post removed (X-No-Archive: yes)
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979207 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 12:37 |
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"Pauli G" <rioroad [at] hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1146104251.745984.49490 [at] u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com...
>
> Geoffrey F. Green wrote:
>> But is NC State willing to pay for a driver to ferry him on all his
>> recruiting visits?
>>
>
> Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach? What's wrong
> with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
When Dick Vitale is in his hotel room and he's a little lonely and he gets
to spanking it and pretty soon he's drooling and slobbering and he's got a
real good jerk and his mind wanders to college basketball uh uh uh the ACC
uuh uh ah stroke basketball schools in North Carolina uh uh ahh ahh Dook
Coack K JJ Shane uh uh uh stroke Tar Heels baby Dean Roy uh uh uh and then
he cums in his sock. NC State doesn't enter into it, not even poor dead
Valvano, and in any other situation Vitale can't go twenty minutes without
shrieking out Valvano's name like he's a tourette's patient. If you're Bob
Huggins do you put yourself in a situation? Hell no.
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979214 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 16:13 |
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On Thu, 27 Apr, Pauli G wrote:
> Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach?
Because they are reaching too high.
> What's wrong
> with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
Proximity to UNC and Duke, plus being in the same conference.
> Finally, why did the powers-that-be fire Herb anyway without having a
> Plan A, Plan B and Plan C?
Looks like they had plans all the way to J or so. Unfortunately all the
plans they had were above them.
--Donnie
--
Donnie Barnes http://www.donniebarnes.com 879. V.
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979220 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 17:33 |
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"Donnie Barnes" <djbSPAMSUCKS [at] donniebarnes.com> wrote
>> Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach?
>
> Because they are reaching too high.
After digging a huge hole.
>> What's wrong
>> with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
>
> Proximity to UNC and Duke, plus being in the same conference.
I'm not sure that's a problem. The potential for god-hood
is what some of these megalomaniacs are after anyway. I
think they really screwed the pooch in how they handled Herb,
even if the first mistake was hiring him. Succeed at NCSU
and you're on par with K and Williams -- set for life.
>> Finally, why did the powers-that-be fire Herb anyway without having a
>> Plan A, Plan B and Plan C?
>
> Looks like they had plans all the way to J or so. Unfortunately all the
> plans they had were above them.
The opposite of that SNL skit, "Lowered Expectations"?
The only possible hope for NCSU now is someone like Huggins.
They aren't going to back on track by playing fair or nice.
--Tedward
--Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979221 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 17:35 |
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"Edward M. Kennedy" <nospam [at] baconburger.com> wrote in message
news:e2qn24$c0v$1 [at] gargoyle.oit.duke.edu...
> The only possible hope for NCSU now is someone like Huggins.
Sorry...I just wanted to read that one more time
Jason Duke
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979222 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 17:39 |
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"Jason Duke" <jasonNO [at] SPAMudhoopsHERE.com> wrote
>> The only possible hope for NCSU now is someone like Huggins.
>
> Sorry...I just wanted to read that one more time
The only possible hope for NCSU now is someone like Huggins.
--Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979223 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 17:47 |
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On Thu, 27 Apr, Edward M. Kennedy wrote:
> "Jason Duke" <jasonNO [at] SPAMudhoopsHERE.com> wrote
>
>>> The only possible hope for NCSU now is someone like Huggins.
>>
>> Sorry...I just wanted to read that one more time
>
> The only possible hope for NCSU now is someone like Huggins.
I think I just threw up a little bit in my mouth.
--Donnie
--
Donnie Barnes http://www.donniebarnes.com 879. V.
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979238 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 21:36 |
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Donnie Barnes wrote:
> On Thu, 27 Apr, Pauli G wrote:
> > Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach?
>
> Because they are reaching too high.
>
> > What's wrong
> > with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
>
> Proximity to UNC and Duke, plus being in the same conference.
>
> > Finally, why did the powers-that-be fire Herb anyway without having a
> > Plan A, Plan B and Plan C?
>
> Looks like they had plans all the way to J or so. Unfortunately all the
> plans they had were above them.
They are working on Plan M. According to press reports 12 candidates
that Fowler has contacted have told him they were not interested.
I keep getting flash forwards of Phil Ford leading the Pack to a win in
the Dean Dome. I hope I am not psychic.
>
>
> --Donnie
>
> --
> Donnie Barnes http://www.donniebarnes.com 879. V.
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979239 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 21:49 |
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"Mr. Poologic.com" <tadamsmar [at] yahoo.com> wrote
> I keep getting flash forwards of Phil Fnord leading the Pack to a win in
> the Dean Dome. I hope I am not psychic.
I think you can rest easy on that one. Ford would have
trouble leading that team back home from a bar.
--Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979241 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 22:02 |
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Edward M. Kennedy wrote:
> "Mr. Poologic.com" <tadamsmar [at] yahoo.com> wrote
>
> > I keep getting flash forwards of Phil Fnord leading the Pack to a win in
> > the Dean Dome. I hope I am not psychic.
>
> I think you can rest easy on that one. Ford would have
> trouble leading that team back home from a bar.
>
> --Tedward
I figure the guy is dry.
Also, I may be a mind reader. I believe Lee Fowler is thinking about
taking the job himself. Or taking an AD job elsewhere.
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979243 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 22:35 |
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"Pauli G" <rioroad [at] hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1146104251.745984.49490 [at] u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com...
>
> Geoffrey F. Green wrote:
> > But is NC State willing to pay for a driver to ferry him on all his
> > recruiting visits?
> >
>
> Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach? What's wrong
> with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
> Finally, why did the powers-that-be fire Herb anyway without having a
> Plan A, Plan B and Plan C?
>
Herb wasn't fired.
db
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979244 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 22:42 |
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On Thu, 27 Apr 2006 16:35:24 -0400, D-unit wrote:
> "Pauli G" <rioroad [at] hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1146104251.745984.49490 [at] u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> Geoffrey F. Green wrote:
>>> But is NC State willing to pay for a driver to ferry him on all his
>>> recruiting visits?
>>>
>>
>> Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach? What's wrong
>> with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
>> Finally, why did the powers-that-be fire Herb anyway without having a
>> Plan A, Plan B and Plan C?
>
> Herb wasn't fired.
What'd they do, then, give him another lifetime contract?
--
The Usenet voice of the Kentucky Wildcats!
(Please ignore.)
_Raw Recruits_ and _Undue Process_ for all,
Welcome to college basketball!
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979245 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 22:37 |
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"D-unit" <c0f [at] intrex.net> wrote
>> > But is NC State willing to pay for a driver to ferry him on all his
>> > recruiting visits?
>> >
>>
>> Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach? What's wrong
>> with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
>> Finally, why did the powers-that-be fire Herb anyway without having a
>> Plan A, Plan B and Plan C?
>
> Herb wasn't fired.
Even worse, he was TROLLED.
--Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979249 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 23:09 |
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D-unit wrote:
> "Pauli G" <rioroad [at] hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1146104251.745984.49490 [at] u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com...
> >
> > Geoffrey F. Green wrote:
> > > But is NC State willing to pay for a driver to ferry him on all his
> > > recruiting visits?
> > >
> >
> > Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach? What's wrong
> > with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
> > Finally, why did the powers-that-be fire Herb anyway without having a
> > Plan A, Plan B and Plan C?
> >
>
> Herb wasn't fired.
>
I don't really follow ACC hoops - what exactly did happen then?
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979250 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 23:17 |
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"Pauli G" <rioroad [at] hotmail.com> wrote
>> > > But is NC State willing to pay for a driver to ferry him on all his
>> > > recruiting visits?
>> > >
>> >
>> > Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach? What's wrong
>> > with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
>> > Finally, why did the powers-that-be fire Herb anyway without having a
>> > Plan A, Plan B and Plan C?
>> >
>>
>> Herb wasn't fired.
>
> I don't really follow ACC hoops - what exactly did happen then?
It goes like this:
"I'm sorry to say this Herb, but you can either resign or
be fired."
"I resign."
He resigned in the same sense that one "donates" their money
to a mugger.
--Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979255 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 00:14 |
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In article <e2rb6a$mhr$1 [at] gargoyle.oit.duke.edu>,
"Edward M. Kennedy" <nospam [at] baconburger.com> wrote:
> "Pauli G" <rioroad [at] hotmail.com> wrote
>
> >> > > But is NC State willing to pay for a driver to ferry him on all his
> >> > > recruiting visits?
> >> > >
> >> >
> >> > Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach? What's wrong
> >> > with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
> >> > Finally, why did the powers-that-be fire Herb anyway without having a
> >> > Plan A, Plan B and Plan C?
> >> >
> >>
> >> Herb wasn't fired.
> >
> > I don't really follow ACC hoops - what exactly did happen then?
>
> It goes like this:
>
> "I'm sorry to say this Herb, but you can either resign or
> be fired."
>
> "I resign."
>
> He resigned in the same sense that one "donates" their money
> to a mugger.
Really? I don't recall reading any of this. I thought he saw the
handwriting on the wall -- it would get harder to recruit because
everyone knew some influential boosters didn't like him, just making
the NCAAs wasn't good enough, etc. -- and decided to head for another
job before he got canned a year or two from now.
- geoff
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979258 ] |
Thu, 27 April 2006 23:30 |
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Post removed (X-No-Archive: yes)
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979259 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 01:13 |
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"Geoffrey F. Green" <geoff-usenet2 [at] stuebegreen.com> wrote
>> >> Herb wasn't fired.
>> >
>> > I don't really follow ACC hoops - what exactly did happen then?
>>
>> It goes like this:
>>
>> "I'm sorry to say this Herb, but you can either resign or
>> be fired."
>>
>> "I resign."
>>
>> He resigned in the same sense that one "donates" their money
>> to a mugger.
>
> Really? I don't recall reading any of this.
Nor do I recall anyone denying it.
> I thought he saw the
> handwriting on the wall -- it would get harder to recruit because
> everyone knew some influential boosters didn't like him, just making
> the NCAAs wasn't good enough, etc. -- and decided to head for another
> job before he got canned a year or two from now.
There's three ways to get fired: outright fired, publicly
asked to resign, and privately asked to leave. It looked
like he was being pushed out. Considering the situation,
giving him a chance to line up a new job was the correct
move to make (it also made it easier for Herb to find a job).
Herb's not a quitter, ASU is a serious step down, and from
what I've heard ASU has an impatient streak similar to State's.
Instead of UNC & Duke, he gets Arizona. It is certainly possible
the nudge wouldn't have come for a year or two, but the facts
don't add up. Herb would have had time to line up a better job.
This seemed rushed.
--Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979260 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 01:22 |
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In article <e2ri0i$ptu$1 [at] gargoyle.oit.duke.edu>,
"Edward M. Kennedy" <nospam [at] baconburger.com> wrote:
> "Geoffrey F. Green" <geoff-usenet2 [at] stuebegreen.com> wrote
>
> >> >> Herb wasn't fired.
> >> >
> >> > I don't really follow ACC hoops - what exactly did happen then?
> >>
> >> It goes like this:
> >>
> >> "I'm sorry to say this Herb, but you can either resign or
> >> be fired."
> >>
> >> "I resign."
> >>
> >> He resigned in the same sense that one "donates" their money
> >> to a mugger.
> >
> > Really? I don't recall reading any of this.
>
> Nor do I recall anyone denying it.
>
> > I thought he saw the
> > handwriting on the wall -- it would get harder to recruit because
> > everyone knew some influential boosters didn't like him, just making
> > the NCAAs wasn't good enough, etc. -- and decided to head for another
> > job before he got canned a year or two from now.
>
> There's three ways to get fired: outright fired, publicly
> asked to resign, and privately asked to leave. It looked
> like he was being pushed out. Considering the situation,
> giving him a chance to line up a new job was the correct
> move to make (it also made it easier for Herb to find a job).
>
> Herb's not a quitter, ASU is a serious step down, and from
> what I've heard ASU has an impatient streak similar to State's.
> Instead of UNC & Duke, he gets Arizona. It is certainly possible
> the nudge wouldn't have come for a year or two, but the facts
> don't add up. Herb would have had time to line up a better job.
> This seemed rushed.
Gotcha. Thanks for the explanation -- that makes sense.
- geoff
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979261 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 01:16 |
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On Thu, 27 Apr, Geoffrey F. Green wrote:
> "Edward M. Kennedy" <nospam [at] baconburger.com> wrote:
>> He resigned in the same sense that one "donates" their money
>> to a mugger.
>
> Really? I don't recall reading any of this. I thought he saw the
> handwriting on the wall -- it would get harder to recruit because
> everyone knew some influential boosters didn't like him, just making
> the NCAAs wasn't good enough, etc. -- and decided to head for another
> job before he got canned a year or two from now.
I agree. Like I said before this went down, I heard there was no way he'd
be forced to resign. He made it clear to the fat-cats that wanted him gone
that they'd *have* to fire him if they wanted him gone. But what happened,
I think, is that ASU wanted a guy like him and made an offer. Given he was
under more and more pressure, even after making the tournament again, he
decided to try something new.
So the pressure *was* a factor, but not the mitigating one. Having another
good offer was more important to the scenario.
--Donnie
--
Donnie Barnes http://www.donniebarnes.com 879. V.
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979265 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 02:52 |
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Edward M. Kennedy wrote:
> I think they really screwed the pooch in how they handled Herb,
> even if the first mistake was hiring him.
But "how they handled Herb" you mean not firing him?
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979275 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 03:50 |
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Mr. Poologic.com wrote:
>
> I keep getting flash forwards of Phil Ford leading the Pack to a win in
> the Dean Dome. I hope I am not psychic.
Phil Ford at State? Isn't the 27th a little late for an April Fool's
article? That's almost like Bobby Hurley coaching Carolina.
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979289 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 14:09 |
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Edward M. Kennedy wrote:
> "Pauli G" <rioroad [at] hotmail.com> wrote
>
> >> > > But is NC State willing to pay for a driver to ferry him on all his
> >> > > recruiting visits?
> >> > >
> >> >
> >> > Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach? What's wrong
> >> > with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
Valvano's book "They Gave Me a Lifetime Contract and then They Declared
Me Dead" is the best analysis of the situation that I have seen.
NC State is the #4 in NC in terms of attractiveness to recruits. The
top 3 are Duke, UNC, and Wake. (Wake being a bit tarnished since
Valvano's time). That makes it very difficult to compete. State is
the best engineering school of the 4, but almost no recruits care about
engineering. The other three are top-notch liberal arts colleges and
therefore have a higher bling-factor with recruits.
During the Valvano era, NC State had a chancellor who would admit
academically unqualified recruits and this closed the recruiting gap
somewhat. But that chancellor resigned under fire and the NCAA rules
now pretty much prevent the kind of situation that existed during the
Valvano years.
On top of that, many stupid NC State fans want to beat Duke and State
and win the ACC championship. They are not satisfied with a team that
makes the NCAA tourney every year.
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979293 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 16:31 |
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"Mr. Poologic.com" <tadamsmar [at] yahoo.com> wrote
>> >> > > But is NC State willing to pay for a driver to ferry him on all his
>> >> > > recruiting visits?
>> >> > >
>> >> >
>> >> > Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach? What's wrong
>> >> > with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
>
> Valvano's book "They Gave Me a Lifetime Contract and then They Declared
> Me Dead" is the best analysis of the situation that I have seen.
>
> NC State is the #4 in NC in terms of attractiveness to recruits. The
> top 3 are Duke, UNC, and Wake. (Wake being a bit tarnished since
> Valvano's time). That makes it very difficult to compete. State is
> the best engineering school of the 4, but almost no recruits care about
> engineering.
Their engineering school is good. I probably wouldn't
put it ahead of Duke though (not that it is fair to
compare a public and private school heads up).
> The other three are top-notch liberal arts colleges and
> therefore have a higher bling-factor with recruits.
>
> During the Valvano era, NC State had a chancellor who would admit
> academically unqualified recruits and this closed the recruiting gap
> somewhat. But that chancellor resigned under fire and the NCAA rules
> now pretty much prevent the kind of situation that existed during the
> Valvano years.
State was a powerhouse for a while.
> On top of that, many stupid NC State fans want to beat Duke and State <== UNC
> and win the ACC championship. They are not satisfied with a team that
> makes the NCAA tourney every year.
There is no reason why State cannot be competitive like
GT or Wake. In fact, they were. Sendek teams were simply
annoyingly consistent -- had his teams overachieved half
the time and tanked half the time, he'd be a hero.
He might actually fit right in at ASU -- IIF he can recruit
there. The move puzzles the hell out of me. He's in a big
hole with a tiny shovel.
--Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979297 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 17:15 |
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Edward M. Kennedy wrote:
> "Mr. Poologic.com" <tadamsmar [at] yahoo.com> wrote
>
> >> >> > > But is NC State willing to pay for a driver to ferry him on all his
> >> >> > > recruiting visits?
> >> >> > >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Why is NCState having so much trouble finding a coach? What's wrong
> >> >> > with the program/school/situation that is a red flag for candidates?
> >
> > Valvano's book "They Gave Me a Lifetime Contract and then They Declared
> > Me Dead" is the best analysis of the situation that I have seen.
> >
> > NC State is the #4 in NC in terms of attractiveness to recruits. The
> > top 3 are Duke, UNC, and Wake. (Wake being a bit tarnished since
> > Valvano's time). That makes it very difficult to compete. State is
> > the best engineering school of the 4, but almost no recruits care about
> > engineering.
>
> Their engineering school is good. I probably wouldn't
> put it ahead of Duke though (not that it is fair to
> compare a public and private school heads up).
>
> > The other three are top-notch liberal arts colleges and
> > therefore have a higher bling-factor with recruits.
> >
> > During the Valvano era, NC State had a chancellor who would admit
> > academically unqualified recruits and this closed the recruiting gap
> > somewhat. But that chancellor resigned under fire and the NCAA rules
> > now pretty much prevent the kind of situation that existed during the
> > Valvano years.
>
> State was a powerhouse for a while.
>
> > On top of that, many stupid NC State fans want to beat Duke and State <== UNC
> > and win the ACC championship. They are not satisfied with a team that
> > makes the NCAA tourney every year.
>
> There is no reason why State cannot be competitive like
> GT or Wake.
I guess Valvano claim that Wake is more attractive than State could be
out of date. So that should make it easier.
But Valvano would claim that GT has the advantage of not having Duke
and UNC within 30 miles.
> In fact, they were. Sendek teams were simply
> annoyingly consistent -- had his teams overachieved half
> the time and tanked half the time, he'd be a hero.
Sendek is a very good coach. I know you don't see it, but ADs all over
the country have a great deal of respect for him. If they had a top 25
poll of coaches where the ADs voted, Sendek would do better than
expected.
Sendek can probably get ASU to the NCAA tourney on a regular basis.
Then all it will take is a couple of back-to-back upsets and he will be
in a Final Four. Then he could end up getting a coaching job at a
better school, since ADs already love him. I think he could start
knocking on the door of the national championship.
The only problem that I have with Sendek is that he too much of a
realist, he does not project optimism. Optimism is a good trait for a
coach to have.
Remember, Sendek just tied Valvano's record for the most consecutive
NCAA tourney appearances by State. One more year at State and he would
have broken it. And he did this in spite of higher academic standards
for recruiting than Valvano faced. This kind of consistency is more
important in evaluating a coach's true abilities than one
flash-in-the-pan unlikely NCAA tourney run to the championship.
>
> He might actually fit right in at ASU -- IIF he can recruit
> there. The move puzzles the hell out of me. He's in a big
> hole with a tiny shovel.
>
> --Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979299 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 18:00 |
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On Fri, 28 Apr, Edward M. Kennedy wrote:
> Their engineering school is good. I probably wouldn't
> put it ahead of Duke though (not that it is fair to
> compare a public and private school heads up).
You wouldn't put what ahead of Duke? Engineering schools? Head to head?
Are you joking me? As I recall, Duke has a couple good engineering
disciplines as well as a couple *really* good grad level disciplines. But
NCSU's engineering school is *very* good in a *lot* of disciplines. Off
the top of my head, and I'll miss some, NCSU has Nuclear, Chemical,
Materials, Mechanical, Computer, Industrial, Aerospace, Civil, Electrical,
Agricultural, and Environmental. Does Duke have anywhere near that many
different engineering disciplines? I'm fairly certain that *each* of those
at NCSU is considered very good.
> There is no reason why State cannot be competitive like
> GT or Wake. In fact, they were. Sendek teams were simply
> annoyingly consistent -- had his teams overachieved half
> the time and tanked half the time, he'd be a hero.
Not buying it. Had they done that, he would have still worn out the
welcome by not making the NCAA tournament doing that.
> He might actually fit right in at ASU -- IIF he can recruit
> there. The move puzzles the hell out of me. He's in a big
> hole with a tiny shovel.
He was at NCSU, too.
--Donnie
--
Donnie Barnes http://www.donniebarnes.com 879. V.
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979300 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 18:24 |
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"Mr. Poologic.com" <tadamsmar [at] yahoo.com> wrote
>> In fact, they were. Sendek teams were simply
>> annoyingly consistent -- had his teams overachieved half
>> the time and tanked half the time, he'd be a hero.
>
> Sendek is a very good coach. I know you don't see it, but ADs all over
> the country have a great deal of respect for him. If they had a top 25
> poll of coaches where the ADs voted, Sendek would do better than
> expected.
Huh? I used to defend Sendek out the wazoo and I agree
he was treated unfairly. I'm just calling the situation
as I see it -- NCSU fans would trade consistency for
occaisional glory (as would many). Sendek is very good
but would never have been great, and that is what NCSU
boosters want.
> Sendek can probably get ASU to the NCAA tourney on a regular basis.
> Then all it will take is a couple of back-to-back upsets and he will be
> in a Final Four. Then he could end up getting a coaching job at a
> better school, since ADs already love him. I think he could start
> knocking on the door of the national championship.
If he coaches a full career he'll eventually get a Final
Four or two. A NC is doubtful but possible. Despite the
shadow of UNC and Duke, NSCU is still a highly desirable
destination in an area and league that appriciate basketball
more than most. He has to recruit outside of the NC shadow
is all (as does K), but I honestly think Sendek's recruiting
woes were more his own doing than the school's situation.
> The only problem that I have with Sendek is that he too much of a
> realist, he does not project optimism. Optimism is a good trait for a
> coach to have.
His offense is over-maligned, but not without some reason.
I think the "optimism" thang ties in with his recruiting
issues.
> Remember, Sendek just tied Valvano's record for the most consecutive
> NCAA tourney appearances by State. One more year at State and he would
> have broken it. And he did this in spite of higher academic standards
> for recruiting than Valvano faced. This kind of consistency is more
> important in evaluating a coach's true abilities than one
> flash-in-the-pan unlikely NCAA tourney run to the championship.
Valvano was more than a flash-in-the-pan and left his successor
with a pretty good team, but I otherwise agree WRT Sendek.
--Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979301 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 18:50 |
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In article <slrne54est.efm.djbSPAMSUCKS [at] localhost.localdomain>,
Donnie Barnes <djbSPAMSUCKS [at] donniebarnes.com> wrote:
> You wouldn't put what ahead of Duke? Engineering schools? Head to head?
> Are you joking me? As I recall, Duke has a couple good engineering
> disciplines as well as a couple *really* good grad level disciplines. But
> NCSU's engineering school is *very* good in a *lot* of disciplines.
Name one impressive NCSU engineering school graduate, or at least one
that's had any sort of success.
- geoff
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979302 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 19:06 |
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"Donnie Barnes" <djbSPAMSUCKS [at] donniebarnes.com> wrote
>> Their engineering school is good. I probably wouldn't
>> put it ahead of Duke though (not that it is fair to
>> compare a public and private school heads up).
>
> You wouldn't put what ahead of Duke? Engineering schools? Head to head?
> Are you joking me?
Not at all, they are both ranked around 30 IIRC, both grad
and undergrad.
> As I recall, Duke has a couple good engineering
> disciplines as well as a couple *really* good grad level disciplines. But
> NCSU's engineering school is *very* good in a *lot* of disciplines. Off
> the top of my head, and I'll miss some, NCSU has Nuclear, Chemical,
> Materials, Mechanical, Computer, Industrial, Aerospace, Civil, Electrical,
> Agricultural, and Environmental. Does Duke have anywhere near that many
> different engineering disciplines?
Quantity vs. quality. Big whoop.
> I'm fairly certain that *each* of those
> at NCSU is considered very good.
I took two courses there to save money. The material seemed to
be the same, the curve easier to beat. That's not a knock, and
isn't a very good sampling either.
>> There is no reason why State cannot be competitive like
>> GT or Wake. In fact, they were. Sendek teams were simply
>> annoyingly consistent -- had his teams overachieved half
>> the time and tanked half the time, he'd be a hero.
>
> Not buying it. Had they done that, he would have still worn out the
> welcome by not making the NCAA tournament doing that.
I think a couple of Final Fours would have done it.
>> He might actually fit right in at ASU -- IIF he can recruit
>> there. The move puzzles the hell out of me. He's in a big
>> hole with a tiny shovel.
>
> He was at NCSU, too.
The only thing ASU has going for it is...well, they are allegedly
in a major conference. I tried to google "arizona state basketball
history" and it hardly seems to exist. Sendek has half as many
NCAA appearances as ASU's entire history.
--Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979303 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 19:50 |
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Geoffrey F. Green wrote:
> In article <slrne54est.efm.djbSPAMSUCKS [at] localhost.localdomain>,
> Donnie Barnes <djbSPAMSUCKS [at] donniebarnes.com> wrote:
>
> > You wouldn't put what ahead of Duke? Engineering schools? Head to head?
> > Are you joking me? As I recall, Duke has a couple good engineering
> > disciplines as well as a couple *really* good grad level disciplines. But
> > NCSU's engineering school is *very* good in a *lot* of disciplines.
>
> Name one impressive NCSU engineering school graduate, or at least one
> that's had any sort of success.
>
> - geoff
Marshall Brain, creator of How Stuff Works
Albert Carnesale, UCLA Chancellor
William C. Friday, President of UNC, etc.
John Edwards, Senator
Hugh Shelton, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
Katherine Stintson, founder of the Society of Women Engineers
They invented plasma TV in the engineering dept, BTW.
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979304 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 20:03 |
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Edward M. Kennedy wrote:
> "Donnie Barnes" <djbSPAMSUCKS [at] donniebarnes.com> wrote
>
> >> Their engineering school is good. I probably wouldn't
> >> put it ahead of Duke though (not that it is fair to
> >> compare a public and private school heads up).
> >
> > You wouldn't put what ahead of Duke? Engineering schools? Head to head?
> > Are you joking me?
>
> Not at all, they are both ranked around 30 IIRC, both grad
> and undergrad.
>
> > As I recall, Duke has a couple good engineering
> > disciplines as well as a couple *really* good grad level disciplines. But
> > NCSU's engineering school is *very* good in a *lot* of disciplines. Off
> > the top of my head, and I'll miss some, NCSU has Nuclear, Chemical,
> > Materials, Mechanical, Computer, Industrial, Aerospace, Civil, Electrical,
> > Agricultural, and Environmental. Does Duke have anywhere near that many
> > different engineering disciplines?
>
> Quantity vs. quality. Big whoop.
>
> > I'm fairly certain that *each* of those
> > at NCSU is considered very good.
>
> I took two courses there to save money. The material seemed to
> be the same, the curve easier to beat. That's not a knock, and
> isn't a very good sampling either.
>
> >> There is no reason why State cannot be competitive like
> >> GT or Wake. In fact, they were. Sendek teams were simply
> >> annoyingly consistent -- had his teams overachieved half
> >> the time and tanked half the time, he'd be a hero.
> >
> > Not buying it. Had they done that, he would have still worn out the
> > welcome by not making the NCAA tournament doing that.
>
> I think a couple of Final Fours would have done it.
>
> >> He might actually fit right in at ASU -- IIF he can recruit
> >> there. The move puzzles the hell out of me. He's in a big
> >> hole with a tiny shovel.
> >
> > He was at NCSU, too.
>
> The only thing ASU has going for it is...well, they are allegedly
> in a major conference. I tried to google "arizona state basketball
> history" and it hardly seems to exist. Sendek has half as many
> NCAA appearances as ASU's entire history.
That makes it a great situation for Sendek. History is what hurt him
at NCSU. If he gets ASU in the NCAA tourney on a regular basis then
they will be happy. He'll be the greatest basketball coach in the
history of ASU.
>
> --Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979305 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 20:14 |
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"Mr. Poologic.com" <tadamsmar [at] yahoo.com> wrote
>> The only thing ASU has going for it is...well, they are allegedly
>> in a major conference. I tried to google "arizona state basketball
>> history" and it hardly seems to exist. Sendek has half as many
>> NCAA appearances as ASU's entire history.
>
> That makes it a great situation for Sendek. History is what hurt him
> at NCSU. If he gets ASU in the NCAA tourney on a regular basis then
> they will be happy. He'll be the greatest basketball coach in the
> history of ASU.
He already is, and it's no given he'll get them to the
tourney on a regular basis. But if he's happy with that,
good for him.
--Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979306 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 20:17 |
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"Edward M. Kennedy" <nospam [at] baconburger.com> wrote
>> Not buying it. Had they done that, he would have still worn out the
>> welcome by not making the NCAA tournament doing that.
>
> I think a couple of Final Fours would have done it.
I should add that in this up-and-scenario he would
have to be much closer to .500 vs. the Evil Twins.
--Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979307 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 20:27 |
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In article <1146246612.844051.189690 [at] j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
"Mr. Poologic.com" <tadamsmar [at] yahoo.com> wrote:
> Geoffrey F. Green wrote:
> > In article <slrne54est.efm.djbSPAMSUCKS [at] localhost.localdomain>,
> > Donnie Barnes <djbSPAMSUCKS [at] donniebarnes.com> wrote:
> >
> > > You wouldn't put what ahead of Duke? Engineering schools? Head to head?
> > > Are you joking me? As I recall, Duke has a couple good engineering
> > > disciplines as well as a couple *really* good grad level disciplines. But
> > > NCSU's engineering school is *very* good in a *lot* of disciplines.
> >
> > Name one impressive NCSU engineering school graduate, or at least one
> > that's had any sort of success.
> >
> > - geoff
>
> Marshall Brain, creator of How Stuff Works
> Albert Carnesale, UCLA Chancellor
> William C. Friday, President of UNC, etc.
> John Edwards, Senator
> Hugh Shelton, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
> Katherine Stintson, founder of the Society of Women Engineers
>
> They invented plasma TV in the engineering dept, BTW.
Subtle.
Joke.
Went.
Over.
Your.
Head.
- geoff
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979308 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 20:32 |
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"Geoffrey F. Green" <geoff-usenet2 [at] stuebegreen.com> wrote
> Subtle.
> Joke.
> Went.
> Over.
> Your.
> Head.
It was about as subtle as a big red dunce cap.
--Tedward
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979309 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 20:45 |
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Mr. Poologic.com wrote:
> Geoffrey F. Green wrote:
> > In article <slrne54est.efm.djbSPAMSUCKS [at] localhost.localdomain>,
> > Donnie Barnes <djbSPAMSUCKS [at] donniebarnes.com> wrote:
> >
> > > You wouldn't put what ahead of Duke? Engineering schools? Head to head?
> > > Are you joking me? As I recall, Duke has a couple good engineering
> > > disciplines as well as a couple *really* good grad level disciplines. But
> > > NCSU's engineering school is *very* good in a *lot* of disciplines.
> >
> > Name one impressive NCSU engineering school graduate, or at least one
> > that's had any sort of success.
> >
> > - geoff
>
> Marshall Brain, creator of How Stuff Works
> Albert Carnesale, UCLA Chancellor
> William C. Friday, President of UNC, etc.
> John Edwards, Senator
> Hugh Shelton, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
> Katherine Stintson, founder of the Society of Women Engineers
>
> They invented plasma TV in the engineering dept, BTW.
Also, I'm pretty sure there are a bunch of NCSU graduate nuclear
engineers that are doing quite successful and impressive work, but I
cannot name them. Impressive work for the governments of their home
Middle Eastern countries.
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979310 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 20:49 |
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In article <1146249911.344590.212000 [at] j73g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
"Mr. Poologic.com" <tadamsmar [at] yahoo.com> wrote:
> Also, I'm pretty sure there are a bunch of NCSU graduate nuclear
> engineers
Making what? Nuclear-powered farm tractors? Fusion-enhanced milking
machines?
- geoff
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| Re: Phil Ford latest name in NC State coach search [message #979311 ] |
Fri, 28 April 2006 20:50 |
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"Mr. Poologic.com" <tadamsmar [at] yahoo.com> wrote
>> They invented plasma TV in the engineering dept, BTW.
>
> Also, I'm pretty sure there are a bunch of NCSU graduate nuclear
> engineers that are doing quite successful and impressive work, but I
> cannot name them. Impressive work for the governments of their home
> Middle Eastern countries.
What are US nuclear engineers doing these days, anyhow?
It's not like they are building nuclear power plants.
--Tedward
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